John Accomando

"AND EXCEPT THOSE DAYS SHOULD BE SHORTENED..."

Daniel 7:25 and Rev. 13:5-7 (as well as Daniel 12) are clear that the saints will be persecuted for 42 months. Prophecy never changes.

"Prewrath", however, argues that Matthew 24:22 means we'll leave before the 42 months are completed:

Matthew 24:22- "And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened."

Again, prophecy doesn't change. What happens at the 4th trumpet? The days are indeed shortened:

Revelation 8:12- "And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise."

This means that a 24-hour day will become a 16-hour day. Likely because the Earth will be spinning faster (perhaps because of "Wormwood" falling onto Earth at the 3rd trumpet).

Therefore, what would normally take 42 months in our current calendar, would only be a total of 28 months if the days are only 16 hours long. Actually, that's only true if the 5th trumpet blows exactly at mid-week. Regardless, even if it blows later, the total cumulative amount of time will be shortened, although we will still be here for 1,260 days (which will then feel like only 840 days). I believe this will increase our chances for survival.

I didn't come up with this concept. I first read it in Steven Straub's book "Changed", and it's beginning to make more and more sense.


Ken Kovach 
I think there are about 5 events in Rev. were the sun is darkened? I'll have to look it up. The fifth vial: dense darkness upon Antichrist's kingdom (16:10-11) Revelation 8:12- "And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise."

But being Darkened doesn't mean the planets stop rotating does it. Hugh earth Quakes could knock earth a bit out of orbit? And maybe cause that. I don't know?

Joshua 10:12-14 (KJV) 12 Then spake Joshua to the Lord in the day when the Lord delivered up the Amorites before the children of Israel, and he said in the sight of Israel, Sun, stand thou still upon Gibeon; and thou, Moon, in the valley of Ajalon. 13 And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day. 14 And there was no day like that before it or after it, that the Lord hearkened unto the voice of a man: for the Lord fought for Israel.


Cptn Sparkeigh 
I am curious as to the part of the verse that says "there should not flesh be saved". How does reducing the hours in the day save Jews and believers from Satan's wrath or God's Wrath, which ever you give credit to?

See, I don't quite understand how you get all of that out of a 'face value' interpretation. The text indicates that 'those days should be shortened' in order to save individuals from the tribulation which would otherwise take their lives. 'Those days' is referring to the Great Tribulation which Jesus just described to the disciples. PreWrath holds that our Lord Jesus Christ brings a stop to Satan's wrath (Revelation 12:12) in order to prevent the entire destruction of Jews and believers. This does not end the 70th week, just the "great tribulation, such as has not occurred . . ." Satan simply will not be permitted to create anymore martyrs under the alter.

Following the Great Tribulation (Those Days) being cut short, the 144,000 are sealed for protection from God's wrath, the believers that remain will be caught up and the trumpet judgments begin. It is with the trumpet judgments, followed by the Bowls, that God dispenses His Wrath.



John Accomando Cptn Sparkeigh,
Matt. 24:22 doesn't say that the prophesied 42 months of persecution gets cut short. Anyone honestly reading that verse will admit that it's the "days" which are shortened. Lo and behold, the 4th trumpet describes precisely that. It's not our job to speculate just how that will increase our chances of surviving the GT. Our job is to know how long Scripture says we're going to be here for, and according to Daniel 7:25 and Rev. 13:5-7, we're going to be persecuted for the full 42 months, so yes, that does bring us to the end of the 70th week.

I've stressed this over and over and over again in most every eschatologic discussion I've been involved with. The Lord NEVER described returning from Heaven with ANYONE other than His angels at His second coming. Neither did Paul describe it in 2 Thess 1:7, which is the ONLY verse in which Paul SPECIFIES who returns with the Lord from Heaven, and Paul is indeed describing Armageddon in 2 Thess 1:6-10. Paul was clear that we "meet the Lord in the air" AFTER He emerges out of Heaven (1 Thess 4:14-17), and Paul never said that the Lord whisks us away to Heaven afterwards.

So we meet Him in the air in our resurrected bodies, and JOIN the armies who have just emerged out of Heaven with the Lord.

Remember, the Lord compared His second coming to the days of Noah and Lot. Neither Noah nor Lot were raptured away to Heaven. Noah was safely above the flood waters, and descended when the waters abated.

Peter was clear that the Lord will remain in Heaven until the "restitution of all things":

Acts 3:20-21: "And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you: Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began."

When is that? What did the prophets speak of?

Daniel 9:24- "Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy."

Only after the 70 weeks are complete will the Lord emerge out of Heaven. Not before those weeks are fulfilled.

Which is why the Lord is still telling us to "watch" for His coming like a "thief" even after the 6th vial:

Revelation 16:15- "Behold, I come as a THIEF. Blessed is he that WATCHETH, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame."

That obviously parallels Matt. 24:42-44 and 1 Thess 5:2 ("thief" reference), yet here is the Lord telling us to "watch" for His coming just before the 70th week is complete. It's also the same vial in which the armies are gathering against Him at Armageddon:

Revelation 16:14- "For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty."

So how can the Lord be telling us it will be at an unknown day/hour? Because the unknown day/hour is Jewish idiom for the Feast of Trumpets, because it takes two watchmen on the wall looking for the new moon. It can only be narrowed to two days on any given year. Guess what the next feast day is on the prophetic calendar? The Feast of Trumpets.

There isn't a single OT description of the DoTL as being a time when the Lord only comes to the sky, fetches believers, and leaves again only to come back several months later. EVERY description is of Him coming definitively, conquering His enemies, and staying.

The rapture DOES happen after the 6th seal, but the 6th/7th seal happen almost simutaneously. The judgments cannot be sequential, for SEVERAL reasons. The 6th/7th seal, 7th trump, and 7th vials occur SIMULTANEOUSLY, and the Lord emerges out of Heaven the second the week is complete. Not once are the trumps called "wrath". Only the vials are the "wrath of God", and I would argue strongly that the "wrath of the Lamb" is referring to the post-70th week DoTL.